really, it went MUCH faster than that and them it cooled down.
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however if the forum is a turntable of a bad situation outside hopscotch (such as sharing personal information on the ytaco), hopscotch is partly responsible for that
ill try 000 but i gotta reply to this one
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For the most part, I’m in favor of the top half of what you said, and neutral on the external communication front.
This seems like a lot more of a pain to implement than there is benefit
It’s a possibility but that that would require more investigation to really find out if it’s a causal relationship.
I think there is definitely potential to do this in a healthy way, and I think there is some value to this. With appropriate moderation, links to other resources should be fine (and already allowed to some extent under the current guidelines, but not quite to the level that you’re describing of course)
There is a side effect of this: Hopscotch is very much involved in their own community and are willing to take and listen to user feedback a lot more than other companies. Additionally, users like me learn new ways to show work we have done, i.e. on GitHub instead of Google sites, and the guidelines have had a pretty large say in me learning how to host HS Tools on GitHub. Might not be the perfect solution, but it’s good to see both sides of this.
Sure, there are things that are inappropriate here and there, but for the most part, I still see this as true. Not because it’s foolproof of things going wrong, but that for the large majority, it is true for both the program itself and the community. I’m sure there’s other things that made you say that – what are your thoughts?
Hopscotch does not have a dedicated moderator team, unlike other larger social platforms. That’s the main reason – it’s not that it’s definitively bad, it’s that Hopscotch doesn’t have the scale to keep every outside link in check.
It is much more relatively safe, but yeah as always everyone should still exercise caution.
I don’t think this is the right mindset to have about everything all the time. Sure, of course there should be caution exercised, but THT has chosen to prioritize safety over the connection of outside platforms – and it is more safe than if there was no moderation about it. Nothing will make it perfect, but that’s also true in the other direction with benefit from external communication. I used to be adamantly against some of the guidelines regarding this as well, but I’ve come to realize a lot of it has more good than harm. Just see my posts from 2019 if you want that side of me.
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I’ve noticed a lot of commenting on the CoF part of the suggestion. I tried to read through people’s responses here regarding the infor before adding my own point but I likely didn’t see everything so apologies if this has been stated before or something similar to that fact…
………I think if communicating with another specific user “privately” is so important to something you are doing on the forum, there should be a way to “private message” on the forum. A few years back this was done via unlisted topics which users would be tagged into as a way of conflict resolution between a few parties without any random interactions from others. More recently I know that moderators can private message users when there is a potential problem like a community warning or something.
………If the private messaging is necessary I feel this could be done as moderators of the forum would have access to the conversation and be able to well you know, moderate. This doesn’t really relate to the point mentioned with avoiding guidelines on the forum but I’m going to be completely honest… you probably shouldn’t avoid those as they’re there for a reason.
………While I understand the desire to talk with a friend outside of the forum, it might not be the safest which is a valid concern in this day and age. Anyways, I guess I’m kind of being hypocritical but I hope I’ve raised some valuable information here or something idk. Enjoy!
-K
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I feel the most concerning part of these recent changes to the subscription paywall for me is the lack of transparency and communication as to why these changes were made. Even though they don’t effect me personally that much, I’m concerned for the future of hopscotch in general, and I hope an explanation as to why hopscotch has shifted in this direction would help me and the rest of the forum community understand the reasoning behind this change. While I don’t necessarily agree with these changes, I’m going to hold back on any feedback or judgement until we have more information as to why tht has made this change. I also get that tht doesn’t have to disclose their reasoning but it could certainly be helpful for all of us. :)
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@Leaders I’m sorry to bother you, but any chance you could cut “CoF” and “CoA” out of the OP? It’s subtracting from the rest of the post.
If you want to put the CoF/CoA stuff in a separate topic instead, that’s fine, I just want it removed from this one.
Thank you.
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I did an edit but I realized I misread your post, so I will revoke the edit. So I didn’t misunderstand: would you like me to cut both of those parts (the headings and the text below) out completely?
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Yes please.
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Got you! Hope the OP looks alright now.
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All good.
Thank you.
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so we all can change our vote on agree now :)
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I think you bring a valid point about the paywall dealio.
………If Hopscotch truly is a coding/collaborating app users should be allowed to code and collab without needing to pay an extra price. I understand needing to make money as a business but then perhaps bring back the project limit for new accounts rather than completely restricting projects.
………I feel that by allowing customers/users to have a taste as to what they can make and do in the app would be more beneficial than forcing payment straight up.
………I feel that parents/guardians/whomever would be more open to allowing their child to use a bit of money towards a subscription if they can see that the app is worthwhile. (I’m being bold and assuming that a Hopscotcher may need to ask for money to get the subscription because I don’t think the target audience is people with jobs but what do I know).
………Anyways this is just my input take it how you will
-K
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I don’t think Hopscotch should even have a project limit. The previous restrictions, but with scenes available to everyone, were fine in my opinion. Alright, they could’ve been better, but still.
Thank you for your input.
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I mean back in my day… 2016 there was no project limit but this often times caused channels to be filled with uncoded projects. So there is probably a sweet spot somewhere between completely restricted and completely unrestricted. And I did mention for new users, not current users as many current users right now are coding more than older users but that’s just my observation.
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How did someone post a fraction of a post /jk
I think Hopscotch should be limitless (like it was before)
But not remove the subscription
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I know I’m responding VERY late, but wanted to pt in my 2 cents, and people on hopscotch already do this. When I was around 10 or 11-ish on hopscotch , on an old account i wouldn’t even be able to remember the name of if I tried, I remember ways of people having conversations with text and remixing, which is fairly normal, you see it all the time on hopscotch, however there’d sometimes be a “hidden” conversation- either with invisible text blocks, text at the end of a title, or even text INSIDE of the code in the form of custom rule blocks. While I never got anyone’s social media or anything, i do think I might’ve been given a users email address or smth at one point (?) really no clue my memory is incredibly vague from that time and obviously it’s not something I’d do today, i hardly even use Hopscotch anymore as is.
From what I’ve seen on hopscotch today, i don’t think these types of “hidden” conversations are as common now, although I honestly don’t really pay much attention to individual conversation projects- i just do know there was a “peak” time period where these hidden conversations would happen, and I’d even stumble upon other people who would be “e-dating” or whatever (it was really weird, especially in retrospect). If anything, i think having a community tab would help to PREVENT these types of hidden convos, as they’d be much easier to access by mods who don’t have the time to check each seemingly innocent conversation project. Individual users could be muted or banned by mods with more ease, and there could maybe be a “mute” button in place for users to use if they have a user they don’t want participating in their community tab. I believe these community tabs, if implemented, would promote transparency in Hopscotch communication and Would arguably even better prevent CoF than the system currently in place, which definitely didn’t prevent me from doing it when i was 10 or 11. A better filter system should also be implemented, as most 10 or 11 year olds understand how to put periods or underscores between swear words, and if a parent or teacher is involved with the hopscotch account they should be able to disable the community tab option if they’d so like. There should also be a time limit (say, 1 message per minute, or maybe 3 messages per 2 minutes, idrk specifics) to prevent spam.
Right now, the only way to communicate ON the hopscotch app, is through remixing these projects. We have the forum, but i didn’t know that existed when I was 10 or 11, and I’d argue a good portion of the younger community doesn’t know it exists either- those that do, if they wanna communicate with a user that DOESN’T have the forum- they’re screwed. Remixing projects is clunky, hard to moderate when you don’t see the inappropriate content in the thumbnail or beginning of a title, and all in all just not a good way to communicate. I strongly believe that community texting tabs, or something similar, would GREATLY benefit the hopscotch platform.
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Responding to my own message with a few more thoughts:
It still might be hard to regulate 1 message a minute, so There could be trust levels similar to those on the forum to prevent this. New accounts might have to wait a few days before accessing the community tab feature, also to prevent spam , and even then maybe they’re given a limited amount of messages before those messages are reviewed by a mod and then a mod approves them as safe to be allowed on the community tab. There could be certain content in messages that flags the message for individual mod requirement, similar to the forum, (the message I’m replying to was individually mod approved).
The forum is in no means a perfect way of communicating for Hopscotch creators, as I already stated above. If it was better advertised or accessible VIA the app itself, then I’d argue it’d be much better - but as far as I’m aware, that’s undoable for the time being. So, i think the Hopscotch app could benefit from some sort of community tab / texting /forum feature based on the rules established by the forum with what works & what doesn’t. I still think we’d see drastic improvements in the way hopscotchers communicate on the app itself - which, i also found a few projects highlighting what I’m talking about when it comes to “hidden” conversations. All these accounts are no longer active, pretty certain none of these people use hopscotch anymore, but I’m linking 3 projects which I feel highlight an issue with the hopscotch app’s communication system (mainly that it doesn’t exist, and it’s filter and moderation in app aren’t all that great(and were arguably even worse a few years ago)) and also highlight that this issue (asking for socials, CoF, hidden convos, the possibility of predatory behavior) DOES already exist and needs to be addressed
This is someone literally openly asking for socials/personal info:
This is someone using invisible text to ask for socials/personal info:
This project, if you click the edit button, you’ll find an invisible text reading “check code” - if you click the check code text to, yk, check the code you’ll find custom rule blocks renamed to tell a conversation (albeit, the one in here seems very innocent, although also this person is literally 12)
As far as I’m aware, these are 3 completely separate users, over the course of multiple years (the second one was posted less than 4 years ago, the third one was posted almost 6 years ago) all of which demonstrating a serious lack of moderation & ease within the current system of communicating with hopscotch that allows for hidden conversations unseen by mods, asking for personal information, and even arguably a lack of proper moderation itself (I mean, the fact the first project is literally still up at all…)
There is a need for SOMETHING to be done… not entirely sure what, but I do think a community tab could work to solve part of the issue… promoting transparency, trust levels similar to the forum, etc… Acting like this issue doesn’t already exist, is plain ignorant.
Also, thinking rn, a large reason a lot of these convos exist is a lack of time buffer between projects. Most people posting projects on hopscotch will spend a couple hours making them, even artists at least 5-10cminutes… I think a 5-10 minute buffer between posting projects, that could be lowered or removed altogether with trust levels, could be beneficial… I think trust levels ON the Hopscotch app in general, could be beneficial. I think they definitely help to keep the forum safe, for sure… the forum to me has always felt a lot more put together, profesional, & safe than the app has ever been (in my own personal experience)
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Also, these projects were easier for me to find since I was able to remember some of the users I saw when I was younger myself and search them up, go into their likes & who they remixed, etc, so they’re all fairly outdated… I’m sure there are much more recent ones, but I don’t regularly use the app anymore, and even the last few years I DID regularly use it, I wasn’t paying much attention to conversation projects … and I actually got the forum, lol. So no clue exactly how prevalent this issue is in THE MODERN DAY. As far as I can assume, I think it *probably * has gotten better , scrolling on hopscotch I see usually less conversation posts in general … also just less posts in general … really no clue. But also as far as I’m aware, this stuff could still easily happen, and it’s because a better, safer way of communication isn’t promoted via the hopscotch app. Hopscotch users WILL still communicate on the app no matter what, no matter the forum’s existence intent, whether it’s through invisible text, code block names , or whatever - wouldn’t you rather it be through a fully visible, more easily moderated, community tab/forum in app?
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If I’m allowed to post this here, I’d like to share a few opinions/agreements, etc.
I know about the conversations going on in the app, and I’ve seen many revealing pi or CoF stuff.
Face reveals, “whole name” reveals, (It won’t let me post it (and for good reason!) but usernames for another social media platform) and “TikTok” usernames are big ones.
I’ve actually gone through the newest tab before, and, if you want to call it, ‘moderated’ the conversations there by flagging/reporting any obvious un-allowed content.
There’s probably lots more hidden in the code though, like you said.
I was just skimming thumbnails.
I don’t really agree or disagree with any method of fixing it, but it’s definitely a concern of mine.
One thing I want to bring up is usernames and pfps.
I’ve seen some very bad usernames that somehow don’t get filtered???
Same with pfps, I’ve seen some with pictures of (I’m assuming) their actual face.
I’m not going to call out names though.
Anyways, just wanted to say that.
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I also remember this from when I was younger! On collab accounts in specific, one person would buy a subscription so EVERYONE could use it to post images- this was also before images were manually approved, I think- so there would be images of real peoples faces as face reveals.
Very glad now for manual image approval (assuming it’s still going on)
The pfps thing MIGHT be celebrities but also maybe not.
Yes, im also unsure on the solutions I presented- still have worries, but in general I think implementing some features & structure from the forum into the app (such as trust levels, more manual approval, time limits, etc) could be hopefully useful. It’s definitely an issue that needs to be resolved, somehow
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